Dec 12, 2015

Saturday, Dec 12th, 2015, Jeffrey Wechsler

Theme: "Ol' Blue Eyes"

Words: 71 (missing J,Q,X,Z)

Blocks: 32

  Well, our Mr. Friday puzzle-constructor makes a rare appearance on Saturday, and carries on with a theme, too~!  A left-right symmetrical grid, with triple 7-letter corners and two "spanners" of 9-letters that are part of the theme.  I wonder if Jeffrey originally tried to work "blue eyes" into the lower left corner at 64a....A few proper names slowed me down, and some misdirection had me off to a slow start, but I did get the "ta-DA~!" - only after I went back and corrected one bad cell.  So, the theme answers;

1. 8-Across member born 12/12/1915 : SINATRA - Frank - his Wiki - I was born in NJ, too~!

Frankie calls the shots

8. Group formed in the '50s : RAT PACK

26. 1-Across hit : THAT'S LIFE

52. 1-Across hit : HIGH HOPES
Carry - on - ward ~!


15. Threatening : OMINOUS

16. Friendly : AMIABLE

17. Super Bowl XXXIII team : FALCONS - I can never remember, and the Roman numerals don't help; waited on perps - I can hardly remember who played in last year's Stanley Cup, once the Rangers were eliminated....

18. New Amsterdam landowner : PATROON - ah, like those who once owned a part of upstate NY that Spitz and I know well....

19. 1958 Pulitzer-winning author : AGEE

20. Moves slowly : SEEPS - or OOZES~?  Had to wait, but the last "S" went in

22. Youngest of the musical Gibb brothers : ANDY - WAG; the others are Barry, Robin and Maurice - these three known together as the "Bee Gees" - the Wiki

23. Antarctica's __ Sea : ROSS - I knew this, but it took R--S for it to come to me

24. Popular side : FRIES - ah, side dish, got it

25. Road Runner cartoon background element : MESA

29. Keep down : OPPRESS - dah~!  Not SUpress or REpress

32. Show of condescension : SNICKER

36. Longtime CBS journalist Charles : KURALT - my one bad cell; don't know how I thought OCAY was OKAY

37. Lament : GRIEVE

38. Part of the Maldives : ATOLL - um, yeah, part....

39. AAA TripTik alternative : GPS - I don't care which one you use, just try not to be "lost" in front of me when driving....

42. Ameliorates : EASES

43. Diner's exclamation : YUM - had no clue at first; then I tried M M M - that's a mere 33%

44. Quick drink : SHOOTER - she didn't bartend where I used to drink....

47. "I feel thee __ I see thy face": Keats : ERE

48. Notice : SPOT

50. Vent emanations : ODORS - not GASES

51. Game in which the player is called the Stranger : MYST - I made it through some of the first game, but it takes a lot of mental concentration to figure it out - there's also a sequel, Riven

55. Woman's name meaning "heavenly" : CELESTE - pretty; I have three names I'd like to give my girls - if I ever have kids....

58. "Garbage in, garbage out" subject : BAD DATA

62. Rainy U.S. capital : OLYMPIA - Washington state - and a place I'd like to live, because it rains a lot

63. Equipped : ENDOWED

64. Innocent-looking : DOE-EYED

65. Dusk : DAY'S END - not EVENING....and not DAY SEND, as I first read it


1. Until now : SO FAR - argh~! Not AS YET

2. Insect stage : IMAGO - DaH~! Not LARVA

3. Longtime radio/TV announcer Wendell __ : NILES - perps and WAG

4. Inherited, perhaps : ANCESTRAL

5. Overly : TOO

6. Malfunctions, as a watch : RUNS FAST - I had GOES FAST, but I was fairly certain the theme was SINATRA

7. Makes a case for : ASSERTS

8. Alpine rescue maneuvers : RAPPELS

9. Getting together : AMASSING

10. Small songbird : TIT

11. Slide subjects : PARAMECIA

12. Have __ to pick : A BONE

13. Oafs : CLODS

14. One of its official languages is Swahili : KENYA

21. Bordeaux : glace :: Berlin : __ : EIS :: London : ice  (look away Tin~!)

27. "__ Kitchen": Gordon Ramsay show : HELL'S - I did watch it for the first season or two

28. Personnel manager, at times : FIRER

29. Approves of : OKAYS

30. Something to do with dukes? : PUT UP - "put up yer dukes~!"

31. PSA, say : PROMO

33. Nurse Ratched creator : KESEY - One Flew Over The Cuckoo's Nest - which swept the "big five" Oscars - there were only two other movies to do so, and I was shocked to find out about the 1991 winner

34. Activist Medgar : EVERS - perps and WAG

35. Go back to zero : RESET

39. Divinity : GODHEAD

40. "Oh, bother" speaker : POOH

41. Pulsed, as light show effects : STROBED

45. Restrict : HOGTIE

46. Miró's birthplace, to Miró : ESPAÑA - Spain, to us it me, or has the Frawnche dropped off~?

49. Motif : THEME - rarely found in a Saturday puzzle

51. Early PC system : MS-DOS

53. Traveling game : I SPY

54. Rapids feature : EDDY

55. Marine oil source : COD

56. Symphonic rock gp. : ELO

57. Pipe cleaner : LYE

59. Knock the socks off : AWE - this style knocks MY socks off

60. X, sometimes : TEN

61. Say further : ADD

Spot on yesterday, Lemonade - my condolences to you as well



Anonymous said...

My clue for 21D EIS – in the L.A. Times itself, on line – was " < span >Bordeaux:< /span > . . . " etc. etc.

john in michigan said...

nailed it...only minor beef was the wording for the olympia clue implied an abbreviation somewhere in the answer

Barry G. said...

Morning, all!

Despite a slow start where I stared at the blank grid for awhile and a few bumps along the way, this ended up being a very quick solve for a Saturday. I really had no idea what to make of the puzzle to begin with, what with the cross-references that meant nothing to me, but once I had TOO and RUNS FAST in place I was able to easily guess SINATRA and that gave me RAT PACK with no perps necessary.

PATROON was completely unknown to me, so that was one stumbling block. The perps were solid, though (despite the odd cluing of RAPPELS as a plural noun instead of a verb). Ditto for SHOOTER - never heard of it, but the perps took care of it.

The KESEY/ERE/EVERS/MYST section was another stumbling block, but I managed to get through that one via some semi-educated guessing. I actually knew KESEY, although it took a little while to remember. I've heard of MYST, although I know nothing about it. ERE seemed grammatical and EVERS looked plausible.

My biggest holdup was actually on the opposite side of the grid where I had SUPPRESS instead of OPPRESS and that kept a lot of stuff from view. I really wanted KURALT, but took it out when I couldn't think of anything for 29D that started with SK. Once I finally took out SUPPRESS, however, it all became clear in a hurry.

desper-otto said...

Good morning!

Wow, a quicky Saturday! "Zoom zoom," as they used to say in the Mazda commercials. I only stumbled twice -- URIS/AGEE and DEPRESS -- never thought of SUPPRESS. OPPRESS finally appeared. And suddenly it was finished.

Charles KURALT was "On the Road" so much that he was able to maintain two families. And he kept the truth from both of them.

Barry, you've never had tequila SHOOTERs? Down the shot, bite the lime. They'll make you see visions -- like the sidewalk at close range.

Hungry Mother said...

Somehow I knew PATROON. A big part of my fun with crosswords is dredging out things from my mind that I didn't know were lurking there.

unclefred said...

Happy day, oh, Happy Day!! I got the Jumble today, and ...AND... the Saturday Xword!! I hardly ever manage the Saturday puzzle. Very slow start. I almost gave up several times but eventually letter by letter with several WAGs, got 'er done!! I was so sure I wouldn't be able to do it at all that I didn't time myself. My guess is about an hour, with part of that time being a diversion into the a BeeGee review side trip. But I GOT 'ER DONE!!

Barry G. said...

Nope, never had tequila in any form. And yes, I actually entered SUPRESS and not SUPPRESS, despite the fact that it's not actually spelled that way. Autocorrect fixed it for me in my comment.

Lucina said...

Hello, friends!
What an unbelievably easy Saturday puzzle! Thank you, Mr. Friday, Jeffrey Wechsler.

Since NBC has been promoting SINATRA's 100th birthday bash all week this fell easily in my camp. From there it was a quick sashay with even FALCONS coming into view with only the F in place.

Ditto for the SUPPRESS/OPPRESS dance.

I had MAP before GPS and recalled MYST from a previous puzzle. I love CELESTE over OLYMPIA as one means heavenly and the other a mountain top. For some reason KESEY came easily though authors' names sometimes elude me. Biology 101 etched PARAMECIA in my mind as we had to illustrate those critters.

Again, thank you, Jeffrey and Splynter for today's amusement.

Have a special day, everyone!

Dudley said...

Hello Puzzlers -

What Hungry Mother said. Also WBS about the Myst/Evers neighborhood. I knew Kesey, but was iffy on the spelling, so I lacked the confidence to try Myst. Got there eventually.

Didn't know, or care, that it's Sinatra's birthday. I honestly feel the man was way, way overrated as a talent.

Morning, Splynter, nicely done! I agree on the sock style. :-)

TTP said...

Morning all.

Had absurd SHA NA NA and couldn't build around it, so it came out. Put in AS YET long before SO FAR

Had AffABLE instead of AMIABLE and left it there too long. By the way, KENYA was easy after the Y from ANDY amd the A from MESA.

The south looked grim until I changed PC DOS to MS DOS. That was also enough to give me MYST, which I've seen in ads and heard of. More importantly, it made HIGH HOPES easy to see. That gave me RAT PACK and SINATRA, and THAT'S LIFE. SINATRA should have been easier to get, since there was a blurb on the news today about it, but I only heard SINATRA.

Gotta run. Taking wife out for breakfast. Late breakfast.

Dudley said...

TTP from yesterday -

The Main/Danube Canal was fascinating. It was beautifully fit into the landscape, such that it had the look of a neatened-up natural waterway. There was a huge change in elevation between the Main and the Danube, which called for 16 locks, some of which were the tallest I've ever seen. The really tall locks moved such large volumes of water that the designers chose to pump the working water into and out from adjacent tanks; otherwise the water losses to run the system would have been more than the natural uphill watershed could have sustained. I bet the pumps are impressive!

Magilla Go-Rilla said...

25A: I knew right away it had to be mesa. When I looked at the cel that was posted for this entry, ironically it was full of buttes. By definition, mesas are wider than they are high and buttes are taller than they are wide. And mesas are typically flat topped. Just another tip from good ole Uncle Magilla😄

Irish Miss said...

Good Morning:

As Lucina said, Sinatra's 100th has been all over the news, so 1A was an immediate given, making the other theme answers easy to figure out. It was not a total walk in the park, but I prefer a crunchier Saturday, ala Mr. Silk.

Nicely done, JW, and nicely deconstructed, Splynter. Thank you both.

Another balmy, Spring-like day. I wonder when Mother Nature is going to realize that it's December, not April! Not complaining, mind you, because, sooner or later, we'll be enduring cold weather and snow.

Have a great day.

Husker Gary said...

PARAMECIA, ABONE, CLODS and KENYA quickly unlocked this rare, easier than usual, themed Saturday puzzle and gave me “High, apple pie in the sky hopes”. What a treat!

-Lauren Bacall is given “credit” for the name RAT PACK that first included her and Bogie
-The OMINOUS music should tell the character to not go into the basement
-Super Bowl XXXIII ads cost a mere $1.6M compared to next year’s Super Bowl L’s $5M
-A former colleague always claimed he was “flexible, AMIABLE and easy to get along with.” He was 0 for 3
-SEEPage from our very high water table require us to have this apparatus
-A little bucolic info – Farm ODORS can tell you what critters are raised there before you SPOT them
-To me, DOE-EYED means this My Fair Lady
-Use this site and you won’t RUN FAST (use arrow for your time zone)
-Do you remember this movie where a fire hose was used to RAPPEL (okay, jump)
-Competitive cooking with a rude, OPPRESSIVE host holds no interest for me
-I play this online so I can hit RESET and not be out any money

Big Easy said...

I guessed SINATRA because my wife was watching a tv special of his BiRTHDAY earlier this week. From there it was basically a speed run with just a few unknowns, NILES, MYST, PATROON, that the perps took care of. Filling 1A & 2A on a Saturday gave me HIGH HOPES of flying through.

I was hoping for a usual Splynter-type phono for 10D but got none. POOH! Well, THAT'S LIFE.

I have an accountant friend who runs his books using MS-DOS, Microsoft Disc Operating System, because he wrote the programs and run faster than on any Windows version. He keeps about 4 spare computers just in case.

See you guys Sunday.

VirginiaSycamore said...

Thanks, Jeffrey, for a fine Saturday puzzle and Splynter for you excellent write-up.

I knew it was SINATRA's 100th birthday today from the news. RAT PACK came easily because I was in a school study group with that name. Our report area was "Small Animal Imaging Methods". RAT PACK was easier to use.

I was able to slog most out with perps, especially when most of a song was solved. I had FIGHTS before PUTUP but once that cleared up I was able to finish the western area.

Other than using a dictionary to check spellings, my only look-up was for WENDELL NI??? in Wikipedia. NILES_WIKI.

42a YUM!_BRANDS is also a restaurant conglomerate, sponsoring the Kentucky Derby. The HQ is in Louisville Kentucky and it includes Taco Bell, KFC, Pizza Hut and Wing Street. I had to go get fried chicken the last time I watched the derby on TV.

13d. It’s been over a year,I posted 6/24/14, so a link to this Mad Magazine CLOD poem is due:
A parody of the Daffodils poem by Wordsworth.
[I wandered lonely as a cloud]

I wandered lonely as a clod,
Just picking up old rags and bottles,
When onward on my way I plod,
I saw a host of axolotls;
Beside the lake, beneath the trees,
A sight to make a man’s blood freeze.
for the rest, go to: LONELY_AS_A_CLOD

VirginiaSycamore said...

My link isn't working. So here's the entire poem, from Mad Magazine, a parody of Daffodils by Wordsworth


I wandered lonely as a clod,
Just picking up old rags and bottles,
When onward on my way I plod,
I saw a host of axolotls;
Beside the lake, beneath the trees,
A sight to make a man’s blood freeze.

Some had handles, some were plain;
They came in blue, red pink, and green.
A few were orange in the main;
The damnedest sight I’ve ever seen.
The females gave a sprightly glance;
The male ones all wore knee-length pants.

Now oft, when on the couch I lie,
The doctor asks me what I see.
They flash upon my inward eye
And make me laugh in fiendish glee.
I find my solace then in bottles,
And I forget them axolotls.

“I Wandered Lonely as a Clod”. (c) 1958 E.C. Publications, Inc.

Lucina said...

I could not agree with you more. SINATRA's voice has always grated on me and overrated is exactly what I think he is. I'm sure his family does its best to keep the memory alive although I know people who go gaga over him, surprisingly including Alex Trebek!

VirginiaSycamore said...

Also, for Anonymous @ 6 am.
It looks like the html code got printed out, not the desired text.

w3schools says that this tag is used for:
( I have put {} for the arrow brackets due to the blog not liking them.)
The {span} tag is used to group inline-elements in a document.
The {span} tag provides no visual change by itself.
The {span} tag provides a way to add a hook to a part of a text or a part of a document.
Example which makes the word blue in blue font color.
{p}My mother has {span style="color:blue">blue{/span} eyes.{/p}


Anonymous T said...

Good morning Sat Solvers...

It took a bit for the theme to dawn on me... SiriusXM ran commercials for Frank's B-Day last night and w/ ----A-K in place, this CLOD filled RAT PACK, et. al. in short order. I'm a good Italian boy...

I had HIGH HOPES (POOH bear gave me that), I was going to finish. BAD (not raw) DATA got an ink-blot Garbage out (I did like MS DOS xing DATA). My puzzle is such a mess and white-squares still abound. I tried to finish, but I couldn't read what I had SOFAR (er, not Since - 1/5 right :-)) through the layers of ink. THAT'S LIFE...

Thanks Jeffrey for the THEME'd Sat (and homage to Frankie). Thanks Splyter for fixing my errors and the Spinal Tap clip. Oh, and she's not at my bar either.

Fav: Theme. (Road) Runner-up MESA (my 1st entry). Only the NE is OKAY w/ just 1 w/o (LikABLE b/f AMIABLE).

Dudley - Overrated? Overrated? Overrated?!? "Say hello to my little friend..." :-)

Frank or Dean is always playing at Pop's house when making sauce.

Cheers, -T

Alex Trebeck's Moustache said...

Lucina, why do you say it is surprising that Alex Trebeck enjoys Frank Sinatra's music? I hope its not because you think intelligent people shouldn't like his music. I fully expect a comment like this from Dudley but I am 'surprised' to see you come off so haughty.

A little background music for anyone would enjoy some seasonal cheer on this fine Saturday afternoon. Where's the eggnog?

Spitzboov said...

Good afternoon everyone.

Good intro, Splynter.

Got a Saturday puzzle on the easy side today. THEMED but, hey; it's the editor's call. Sufficient reason to make an exception, today. The rest of it was a little prickly, but doable. Enjoyed the exercise, Jeffrey.
PSA - Prompted from perps. My medical history prioritizes it as prostate-specific antigen - no match for the 5 cels.
Miró - The Albright-Knox art gallery in Buffalo has some of his art. Good stuff.
PATROON - I think we, as New Yorkers, learned about the Dutch colony and patroons in the 8th grade. I believe RPI bestows that appellation on its top rank of alumni benefactors.

desper-otto said...

Back in the late '70's KAIR 1490 AM in Tucson boasted, "Spend the winter with Frank Sinatra. After all, he's the only vocalist we play." Frank didn't help much. That station always struggled, changing call letters and ownership over and over.

Lucina said...

Alex Trebek's Moustache@12:47
No, I did not mean to be haughty and I take umbrage at your disparagement of Dudley. What surprised me was that Alex mentioned last night that Sinatra was his favorite singer. It was just a surprise, that's all. No judgment was made on his taste. I know many people who like Frank's music. I just happen not to be one.

Jayce said...

For some reason it took me a long time to fill the S crossing MYST and EVERS. After doing an alphabet run to get it, even after filling it I wondered, also for far too long, what "My St" was. Sheesh.
Other than that, I solved it all without having to look anything up, albeit with much head scratching. This is the kind of puzzle I like.

Bill G said...

Hi everybody! I really enjoyed having a little theme in this Saturday offering. I can't remember another themed puzzle on Saturday. Can you? For you constructors, is a difficult themed puzzle harder to create than the usual themeless Saturday puzzles? Thanks Jeffrey and Splynter.

Re. Sinatra: I agree that his voice was just OK. Sinatra's talent seemed to be in his ability to choose an excellent song and arranger. Then his interpretation and phrasing made the whole thing memorable. I watched part of the Sinatra 100-year tribute on television. Every song has been an gem so far. All of the songs have stood the test of time. I would be surprised if most of the songs written and sung these days last beyond a month or two.

MYST was a great computer game. There was no chasing or shooting; just puzzling situations to figure out and solve. Really good! Another game for the Mac that was more of an arcade game was Crystal Quest. I'd pay to get a new version if there only was one.

redtail said...

Maybe it was a little easy, but this is the first time EVER that I have solved a Saturday puzzle, in ink, without a single mistake. Happy Birthday, Frankie, and thanks for this memory.

AnonymousPVX said...

I was all proud of myself today, especially as compared to yesterday, and then I read here how everybody else thought this a "gift" puzzle.

Okay, nothing wrong with an easy Saturday.

PK said...

Hi Y'all! I'm beginning to really like Jeffrey's puzzles. Sorta hard but I finally get 'er done. Besides there are enough innuendo words that I always feel there is a naughty joke in there somewhere. CLODS SNICKER at DOE EYED CELESTE whose well-ENDOWED TITs raise HIGH HOPES for A-BONE. THAT'S LIFE! YUM!

I watched SINATRA's birthday bash on TV for lack of something better. Not a fan, although I sang a lot of his hits on stage as a teenager. SINATRA's talent is more obvious when you hear today's big name stars sing his hits and they don't sound as good. Carry Underwood's rendition is the exception. Some of his songs were so corny, (Oops there goes another rubber tree plant?) they tend to tickle the funny BONE & keep looping in the brain.

D-O: Your post reminded me of a sign I saw in a gift shop: "One tequila, Two tequila, Three tequila, FLOOR. I wanted to buy it for a male friend, but lacked the nerve.

Don't know how I dredged up IMAGO after trying, "larva", "Pupae", "adult"... But I typed 'er in thar.

Thanks once again, Splynter, for not giving us any BAD DATA.

Yellowrocks said...

I love Sinatra's songs,
I am amazed that when some of us regulars express a personal preference of not liking some things others particularly like we are termed haughty or worse. Lucinda, you are far from haughty. To each his own.
I am enjoying the background music. Thanks.

Avg Joe said...

Musical taste is intensely personal. Two given individuals may have a lot of overlap in their personal soundtrack, but I've yet to meet anyone that liked everything I like or disliked my entire "boring" list. That's just the way it is. I'm not a Sinatra fan, but I recognize that fans are legion, and you can't call them wrong. And even if you don't care for his standards, you need to acknowledge his contributions. He is a legend, like him or not.

On another topic, I found myself missing Marti today. I was driving down the street and saw a pickup with advertising on the door. I recalled a comment she made while blogging a puzzle with a clue that was related to designer jeans with embroidery on the back pockets. She said: "If you can't hide it, advertise it."

The sign on the door of this pickup? "Don's Erection"

Don must be very proud.

Ergo said...

Thanks Jeffrey and Splynter.

Sakes. Everything but that blasted NW corner. Been working on it off and on all day and finally had to throw in the towel.

A good sense of accomplishment though for a Saturday offering.

Jayce said...

Avg Joe, well said.

OwenKL said...

Very, very late today. Windows 10 finally showed up yesterday. Between steps I was able to post my poems yesterday, and later work today's puzzle {Yipee, it's one of those rare weekends when I was able to beat both the Fri and Sat grids!}. But it took most of the day to install, and has a nasty learning curve. Plus it's even slower than Win7, which I didn't think was possible! Firefox is still working about the same, thank goodness, tho slower. But the stickynote app I depend on most, while it is working, has some bugs.

Magilla: you're right, there are no mesas, but there are also only one or two buttes in that picture. Buttes also have flat tops. Most of those formations are hoodoos. A hoodoo (also called a tent rock, fairy chimney, or goblin) is a tall, thin spire of rock that protrudes from the bottom of a canyon or badland.

Anonymous said...

YR: I believe posters are termed haughty when expressing their dislike for something only when they go overboard. For instance the other day you stated you didn't like non traditional haiku. Fair enough but then you went on to say in fact "it offends me". Foul! Then today Dudley writes that Sinatra is overrated. A little harsh and a tad more than merely saying he didn't like him. But he enters the snooty zone when decides to qualify his opinion by insisting not only overrated but "WAY, WAY overrated". As Joe nicely stated beauty/art is in the eye of the beholder. I'm "surprised" Y'all like downtown abbey as I believe it is way, way, way overrated but I would never say that. : )

PK said...

Owen, thank you for mentioning hoodoos. When I saw that picture of roadrunner & coyote, I thought that looks more like Brice Canyon than anyplace else. I've been trying to recall the word "HOODOO". They sure don't look like mesas or buttes to me.

YR, when I said I'm not a Sinatra fan, I don't mean that I don't like his music so much as I don't get ecstatic over the man & his talent. A fan has a lot more enthusiasm than I can muster. I did like his voice & music, but not LOVE it. He was kind of scrawny and his physique didn't appeal to me, being used to muscled well-fed farm boys. I did like a couple of his movies where he didn't sing. The whole rat-pack lifestyle put me off too.

CrossEyedDave said...

Back from Boston, 5 hours up, 4-/1/2 hours back.
Only one 70 mph to zero panic stop to avoid a 6 car pile up
with my hazard lights to warn the tailgating truck behind me...

& no speeding tickets...

All in all, a good trip...

I looked at the puzzle when I got home, even though I was exhausted & needed sleep.
I saw 1 & 2A, & thought, "I know this!" I have a chance to finish a Saturday Stumper!
I can't remember the guys name, but the group has to be ShaNaNa!
(Hmm, what was his name? Bowzer or something?)
Yeah, born 1915 told me i was wrong, no self respecting greaser would be over 30 years old...

But that made Sinatra & Ratpack gimmes!

& then I fell asleep...

Oh well,
learning moment has to be 42A, Ameliorates =easy.
I looked it up & this is what Google showed me.

CrossEyedDave said...

To add injury to insult,

I just rec'd a hysterical phone call from Daughter #1.
3 days ago she stepped on a piece of glass, has no health insurance,
& was too afraid to let the local clinic use a scalpel without anesthetic
to cut it out of her foot.

She was hobbling on her injured foot to work when she was pushed and fell
on a child on the crowded sidewalk in NYC. I do not yet know all the details
other than the Mother of this child punched her in the face!

She is over 50 miles away & I feel helpless.

Things are not boding well...

Bill G said...

CED, geez, that's a lot of bad news. It would upset me too. Here's my two-cents worth.

Daughter #1 will heal. I'm assuming she has no more contact with the Mother. If her foot needs fixing, send her the money and let her decide what to do about the anesthetic. If she needs her hand held, you are in for a 100-mile round trip. I hope all will be OK by next week.

I think a face-to-face talk with the doctor is a good idea if you can get past his front office. If the doctor has sold his bad debt to a collection agency, it may be that you will have to deal with them instead of him. They will probably start by playing hard ball and threatening all kinds of crap but will eventually accept a smaller payment. If they won't discuss a reasonable compromise, you are probably going to need a lawyer. Even Legal Aid might be a help.

Good luck on both issues.

Paul in Montebello said...

This was an easy Saturday puzzle. After I got Myst...I kept thinking the words, "Who are you?" and was wishing I still had that game.

Yellowrocks said...

CED that is terrible news. What a shock. I hope talking to the doctor face to face will help. That's a huge amount of money. I agree with Billg's advice.
I hope your daughter has gotten her foot taken care of and is not risking infection. As well as being dangerous to her health, it could cost more in the long run.

Yellowrocks said...

Anonymous @8:23 said, "I believe it is way, way, way overrated but I would never say that. : )" Actually you just said it!
I believe that being so judgmental and calling people out is much worse than their expressing very strong opinions about what they dislike. It falls under CC's guidelines about about personal attacks. What makes you the arbiter of how we express our opinions?
PS, I don't like Downton Abbey but am not upset that others love it and praise it to the skies, or, on the other hand, dislike it intensely.

PK said...

CED: I have had some smaller bills come in from Drs. & places I never thought I knew. They usually have turned out to be the contracting doctor who read xrays or CT scans etc., an independent lab, an independent contracting anesthesiologist who bills through another hospital or clinic. Could it be a neurosurgeon called in to assist during your surgery? $20,000 does seem over the top. Can you google the billing hospital & doctor to find out more about them before you go charging into your doctor's office? Usually those doctors like to see their resumes on Facebook and you can glean some info. Could just be a scam too.

Good luck! I feel your pain. I had sciatic problems several times in the past and would have done just about anything to relieve it. Luckily, I didn't have to have surgery

Anonymous T said...

CED - I just got a bill for $$$ from when I broke my ribs. I'm sure it is all the "3rd-parties" in the hospital. I'm going to start w/ my ins. co and then my lawyer to see what my options are. I'm sorry you have to deal w/ that & daughter's foot on the same day pal. C, -T

inanehiker said...

@CED - the doctor can make committments for the charge for his own services - but not for the hospital, if you had the surgeries at the hospital. But you can talk to the people at the hospital and negotiate down the charges especially if you didn't have an insurance company that already have negotiated rates themselves. The out of pocket seems high because most insurance policies have an out of pocket maximum well under 20,000 for an individual even if you have a high deductible plan. Not knowing more details I can't be more specific, but if the bill is from the hospital going to the doctor's office is not the place to get something done. If you think the doctor was out of line in having you do all these surgeries - contact your state board of healing arts (or state medical board - they are called different things in different states) to make a formal complaint about the doctor.