Feb 17, 2020

Monday February 17, 2020 John R. O'Brien

Theme: JULIUS CAESAR (56. Attributed speaker of the circled words)

20. Deer hunter's dinner, perhaps: VENISON STEAK.

34. Cutting in half, in math class: DIVIDING BY TWO.

42. Nearby: IN THE VICINITY.

Boomer here.  

Interesting - I came, I saw, I conquered. Once again my high school Latin pays off.  Speaking of Julius Caesar's Palace, we drove by it last week on the way to Palace Station and the Fashion Show Mall. I did not conquer Caesar's but I did beat up on a couple of Craps machines.  Not huge, but I did go home with what I brought. It was the Annual meeting of OMEGA (Older More Energetic Graybar Associates), retirees at the Orleans.  I generally give a little of my humor to my "Medicare Miracle" friends. My middle name is Robert and my mother's name was Hope so I give them a little Bob Hope act.  All I needed was Bing Crosby and Raquel Welch.


1. Weed whackers: HOES.  I use the motorized kind with a nylon string that spins.

5. Annoy: MIFF.  Sometimes the craps dice can make you MIFFED.

9. Macbeth, by birth: SCOT.

13. Saintly glows: AURAS.  Las Vegas lights are something else.

15. Impressionist: APER.

16. Lola's nightclub, in song: COPA.  Home of Desi Arnaz' act. I don't think Bob Hope ever played there.

17. Like an old joke: STALE.  Yeah, I told a few of them at the banquet.

18. Wind that's worth a warning: GALE.  Could be Dorothy GALE from Kansas.

19. Idi of Uganda: AMIN.

23. Holy Ohio city?: TOLEDO.  Home of the Mud Hens.

26. Bridal bio word: NEE.

27. Sault __ Marie: STE.

28. "I think," to a texter: IMO.  In My Opinion.

29. Childlike race in "The Time Machine": ELOI.

32. Learn thoroughly: MASTER.  Coming to Augusta in April.

37. Seine summers: ETES.

38. Lincoln or Ford: CAR.  We rented a Ford Escape. If you are a Medicare Miracle don't even think about it.

39. Love, in Spain: AMOR.

47. Fidel who overthrew Batista: CASTRO.  U.S Presidents last 4 or 8 years.  This guy lasted til my hair started turning white.

49. Aussie birds that don't fly: EMUS.

50. San Francisco's __ Valley: NOE.  Another spelling of the name of the guy who floated a ship in a flood.

51. Diplomatic VIP: AMB. Ambassador.

52. NBA tiebreakers: OTS.  Our Timberwolves are usually 30 points behind so no overtime is necessary.

54. Sports team swaps: TRADES.  Twins made a bunch of trades this winter.  "World Series here they come ???"

60. Medical suffix: OSIS.

61. Sentry's "Stop!": HALT.

62. Swiss peak in an Eastwood film title: EIGER. The Eiger Sanction.

66. Eye part: LENS.  Eye of a camera??

67. Oil cartel letters: OPEC.

68. Iced tea wedge: LEMON.  I like a little lemon in iced tea.  But we don't drink it in the frozen tundra,

69. Icelandic poetic work: EDDA.

70. PC repair person: TECH.  Up here they are called the Geek Squad from Best Buy.

71. Avec's opposite: SANS.


1. Suffers from: HAS.

2. One of an inning's three: OUT. "And it's ONE, TWO, THREE Strikes you're out at the old ball game"

3. Pitcher's stat: ERA.  This can be raised if someone sets up a camera in center field and signals the guy with the bat to hit the trash can.

4. Soothing cream: SALVE.  I've tried Blue Emu, Arctic Ice and Biofreeze. I am open to suggestions.

5. Carol kings: MAGI.  "We three kings of Orient are, bearing gifts we traverse afar."

6. Hoppy brews, for short: IPAS.

7. Serious criminal: FELON.  "When a FELON'S not engaged in his employment, or construing his felonious little plans... His capacity for innocent enjoyment is just as great as any honest man's."

8. Portmanteau for a false ally: FRENEMY.

9. "Beat it, feline!": SCAT.  I'm not done yet!!

10. Is remembered: COMES TO MIND.  February 14 comes to mind.  Belated Happy Valentine's Day.

11. Addictive narcotic: OPIATE. In 2018 I needed to take some of that Oxy stuff for pain. I did not feel addicted, but I only took it for a month or so.

12. Oil cartel ship: TANKER.

14. Started the grass-growing process: SEEDED.  Give me a couple of months.  The snow plow guy that does our driveway created some lawn to plant.

21. __ me tangere: "Don't touch me": NOLI.

22. Place to park it: SEAT.  I heard a cheap one at the Super Bowl ran about $2500.00.

23. Ocean motion: TIDE. We wash our clothes with Purex.

24. Skip over: OMIT.

25. Age-old romantic adage: LOVE IS BLIND.

30. A single time: ONCE.  "ONCE upon a time there were three bears".  You know the rest.

31. "__ it my best": I GAVE.  I GAVE the craps machine my best shot.  I like the machine because the minimum bet is very low, compared to the live tables.

33. Graceful pond swimmer: SWAN.

35. "That __ fair!": ISN'T.  Slot machines do not have slots anymore, just a place to slide in your Twenty.  What ISN'T fair are the bright lights promising jackpots in the thousands.  You can't fool me.  However I did win $17.00 on a .40 cent play once.

36. Fedora feature: BRIM.

40. Great Plains tribe: OTOE.  Once in the Great Lakes area, The OTOE moved south through Iowa and Missouri.  I think they are alive and well in Oklahoma.  I guess they couldn't take our winters.

41. Deli breads: RYES.  St. Patrick's day is coming.  Time for corned beef, Swiss cheese, sauerkraut on RYE.

43. Pants, briefly: TROU.

44. Someone who's good, and obviously knows it: HOTSHOT.  You're a poet and you don't know it, but your feet show it, they're Longfellows.

45. Skips, as class: CUTS.

46. Tel Aviv's land: ISRAEL.

47. Sweet-talk: CAJOLE.

48. Got a smile out of: AMUSED.  Here goes my intro. "I want to thank the company president for hosting this fine banquet and especially for letting us know that the people that were hired to replace us are doing a helluva lot better than we ever did."

53. Suffix with land or sea: SCAPE.  Or put an "E" in front of it and you're outta here.

55. Spring zodiac sign: ARIES.  Three days after St. Patrick's day.  Hope you have some corned beef left.

57. "Insecure" Emmy nominee __ Rae: ISSA.

58. Knighted actor Guinness: ALEC.  Obi Wan Kenobi.

59. Draw with acid: ETCH.  If you once owned an Etch-a Sketch you are a Medicare Miracle.

63. ABC show for early risers, briefly: GMA.

64. Long, long time: EON.  "A Long, Long time ago, I can still remember how the music used to make me smile."  Don McClean - "American Pie."

65. ICU workers: RNS.


Note from C.C.:

Here is a picture of Boomer in front of The Orleans. It was a long trip. We left home at 2:30am on Sunday and arrived at our hotel room at 6:00pm. Heavy snow plus a few other issues. Boomer's annual Graybar OMEGA gathering went nicely tough. Here is a clip of his old colleagues at the event. The lady at the 1:44 minute mark is the big boss.


Jinx in Norfolk said...

FIR, but erased iris for LENS. Actually just the "r", since the conversions from"I" to "L" and the other "I" to "N" were mere embellishments. Had to wait for AURA[E/S]. DNK NOE, EIGER, NOLI or ISSA.

I learned VENI, VIDI, VICI when I was in high school and asked my Latin teacher what the saying on my pack of Marlboros meant. Smoking was more accepted in those days. But we were so poor that when we went to concerts people in the area shared the same cigarette. Marlboros were $0.18 per pack then.

Thanks to John for the fun, Monday-easy puzzle. And thanks to Boomer for the funny review. Glad you had fun at the reunion. BTW, any SALVE with 4% lidocaine is about as good as you can get OTC. I use Walmart's house brand on my torn meniscus, hoping to avoid the knife. Seems to help.

Hungry Mother said...

Easy enough and FIR but I grew up in the Bay Area from 1940-1952 and never heard of NOE Valley.

desper-otto said...

Good morning!

Zipped right through this one. The theme seems a month early. Had the circles, or I would've missed it. I was working the downs this morning, so I completely missed seeing NOE (?), CAR, IMO, ETES, STE and SANS. Thanx, John and Boomer. (Were there any ladies you didn't pose with?)

"Nicely tough" -- CC, you've got a way with words.

PhillyCarey said...

I was wondering what IPEC was. Anyone else? (Turned out it was OPEC)

desper-otto said...

Good one, Unknown.

Lemonade714 said...

According to Quora: Noe is a Spanish word, so each vowel gets pronounced. The closest would be NO-eh, where eh sounds like the e in bent. NO-eh VAL-ee. Try to ignore the typical American diphthong that turns it into "no-way valley". They say it is a sunny part of the city. Here is a LOCAL GUIDE .

My Latin education was good, but I did not understand the context of NOLI ME TANGERE.

Sounds like a great trip. Thanks for our ride Boomer and JRO'B

TTP said...

There's TROU again. Not a word I would use. Ditto on AMB.

DNN: NOLI and NOE. Thanks for the links, Lemonade. I liked the part when I read the explanation on NOLI:

"Noli me tangere" is the Latin version of the original Greek expression "mê mou haptou".

Oh, now it's clear.

Boomer, last week at our golf league sponsor's pub, the guy next to me at the bar won $20 playing scratch off lottery cards. He then won $250, and then on the very next card won another $250. I don't play and don't normally pay attention, but he was right next to me. Later I found out he plays all the time. Still, to win twice in a row like that...

Jinx, you made me look. I still have four 5% lidocaine patches (Rx) left in my drawer. The expiration date was 5/2017.

inanehiker said...

This was a speedier than usual Monday with the early fill of VENI, VIDI, VICI!
When I lived in the Bay Area I knew of NOE Valley, but didn't know how it was spelled.

It smells really strong, but my granddad and uncle used to swear by Tincture of Arnica for sore joints - my uncle continued to play racquetball into his 70s so it must have worked for him!

Glad you all had a good trip Boomer& CC - but 2:30? We are used to that living 2-3 hours from a major airport - but thought you would have had a better departure time living near MSP- or did you choose to go early to get the best airfare??

Thanks Boomer and John!

Boomer said...

TTP - We do not play our Minnesota Lottery very often and I cannot remember winning more than $3.00 on a one dollar ticket. About 5 years ago on a trip to Las Vegas, I noticed one of these Craps machines in the Orleans casino. Since their craps table has a $5.00 bet minimum and always has about 12 people elbow to elbow around it, I tried the machine. There is a one dollar minimum bet, (Like the old days) so I can play within my budget with maybe $3.00 on the pass line, $6.00 odds (that bet is fair odds, no house advantage) and maybe spread $12.00 across on the numbers and push it up a little if they start hitting. There was one play last weekend when I worked a $200.00 profit on the machine, but mostly I would win a little or lose a little and know when to quit. I came home with about $80.00 more than I brought and that was after a couple of buffets, some gift shop snacks, and gratuities. A pretty good weekend after waiting nearly nine hours for Sun Country to get us there.

Spitzboov said...

Good morning everyone.

Another fine intro, Boomer. Thanks.

No problem with the solve. When I saw that 56a was going to be JULIUS CAESAR, I went back and filled in the remaining circles which then coughed up their longer host words. So much of this solved itself. No issues.
The First Point of ARIES, also known as the Cusp of Aries, is the location of the vernal equinox, used as a reference point in celestial coordinate systems. (Actually, that point is now in Pisces due to the further precession of the Poles.)
TIDES - The Fundy TIDES range about 43 ft. The Hudson at Troy (1 mile from IM) ranges just over 5 ft.

Have a great day.

Yellowrocks said...

Easier than a usual Monday. I suspected the theme with VENI in the circles and confirmed it with the V in LOVE.
Only ISSA and NOE were new to me. Darrell Issa could have been a gimme because he has been in the news quite a bit.
COMES TO MIND often used to be leaps to mind. Now, sometimes, "it comes in on little cat's feet," like the fog.
I usually wear my bathing suit under my clothing when I drive to the Y pool. Today I forgot to check my backpack before I left home and had to drive home commando style.
To me, MIFF is being only slightly annoyed, like after a little tiff or spat.
Inanehiker, my MIL used to use actual 50 year old horse liniment left over from her farming youth.
I have seen at least four or five interpretations from scholars of "Noli me tangere." It seems to me there is no definitive answer.
I find TROU in period novels, but more currently in DROP TROU, dropping trousers and under wear when mooning, or when getting an injection in the butt from the doctor.
I am in the midst of booking square dancer callers for an entire year. It always goes swimmingly until the very last contact, and then it is like a difficult Sudoku, where you have to go back and rework many parts.

Ray - O - Sunshine said...

Competed SANS "erreur". Able to RYEs to the occasion. No need to CAJOLE an anwer..(Big deal, HOTSHOT, it's only Monday!)

Waited out halos versus aurae versus ..finally.. AURAS

For JULIUS CAESAR it took "GAUL" to utter those 3 words.

He also wrote "Gallia est divisa in partes tres" so DIVIDING IN TWO should have been THREE.

(BTW he managed to turn a centuries old republic into a dictatorship by intimidating the senate)

A term for "mooning" from my ancient college days ..."drop TROU."

COPA...2 same sex male parents?

As I continue to pursue crossword solving my brain has evolved a lobe for the storing of obscure words I've encountered and need to conjure up exclusively for crosswords like...abaci..aglet..edda..ewer..but as my cerebral cortex atrophies adding to or accessing it is becoming ever more problematic.

TTP said...

Boomer, good ! Almost forgot to go back and watch the video pics. Must have been nice to see old friends and coworkers again. Sounds like you had fun.

triple crown said...

Hey Boomer.
Try Aloe Gel for skin irritation. CVS has a product called After Sun Aloe Vera.

Husker Gary said...

-A fun puzzle and decent weather to help celebrate finishing 53 years of marriage today
-The past few days show Joann takes “in sickness and in health” very seriously. LOVE IS BLIND!
-“Carol kings” alone was worth the price of admission!
-Crazy King Ludwig II built his Neuschwanstein Castle so he could see his beloved SWANS on Alpsee Lake below. In fact Neuschwanstein means New Swan Castle.
-OCD me has never CUT a class
-Sir ALEC – Cue this stirring scene and unforgettable music!

Madame Defarge said...

Good Morning.

Thanks John for a good Monday run. I really fell into place here. VINI. VIDI. VICI. All the long fills worked for me on my first guesses beginning with JULIUS CAESAR after I had VENI. I know it's Monday, but I felt pretty smart today--especially with my recent slow down on completing puzzles correctly.

Nice tour, Boomer. It sounds like your trip was worthy of the time in the car. Hooray.

Be well, everyone.

Lemonade714 said...

Tom, I am sorry for my bad explanation. I should have said, see Μή μου ἅπτου . Since this is all Greek to you, it is good.

TTP said...

Husker, not even on Senior Skip Day ?

Madame Defarge, congrats on your success ! Practice makes perfect. Keep at it.

Yellowrocks, I didn't get MIFFED when an older gentlemen pushed his cart into my butt at the home improvement store Sunday as I was reaching for an upper shelf item. I don't think he really realized he bumped into me. A few minutes later, further down the same aisle, he sideswiped my leg with the cart and his cart wheel was pushing hard against my foot. At that point, rather than getting annoyed, I left that aisle to pick up a couple other items on my list. Lo and behold, just as I picked my items, he and his wife (or daughter) came into that aisle. I went out the other end and went back to the aisle where he first bumped me. I only hoped that she was the one that drove to the store.

Boomer, I'm still working on getting this year's golf league set up. Mostly USGA rules. Here are some rules for seniors that did not get approved at the league meeting:

Rule 9.k.34(a): If a tree is between the ball and the hole, and the tree is deemed to be younger than the player, then the ball can be moved without penalty. This is so because this is simply a question of timing; when the player was younger, the tree was not there so the player is being penalized because of his age.

Rule 1.a.5 - A ball sliced or hooked into the Rough shall be lifted and placed on the Fairway at a point equal to the distance it carried or rolled into the Rough with no penalty. The senior (70 and older) player should not be penalized for tall grass which ground keepers failed to mow.

Rule 2.d.6 (B) - A ball hitting a tree shall be deemed NOT to have hit the tree. This is simply bad luck and luck has no place in a scientific game. The senior player must estimate the distance the ball would have traveled if it had not hit the tree, and play the ball from there.

Rule 3.B.3(G) - There shall be no such thing as a lost ball. The missing ball is on or near the course and will eventually be found and pocketed by someone else, thereby making it a stolen ball. The senior player is not to compound the felony by charging himself with a penalty.

Rule 4.c.7(h) - If a putt passes over a hole without dropping, it is deemed to have dropped. The Law of Gravity supersedes the Rules of Golf.

Rule 5. - Putts that stop close enough to the cup that they could be blown in, may be blown in. This does not apply to balls more than three inches from the Hole. No one wants to make a mockery of the game.

Rule 6.a.9(k) - There is no penalty for so-called “out of bounds.” If penny-pinching golf course owners bought sufficient land, this would not occur. The senior player deserves an apology, not a penalty.

Rule 7.G.15(z) - There is no penalty for a ball in a water hazard, as golf balls should float. Senior players should not be penalized for any shortcomings of the manufacturers.

Rule 8.k.9(S) - Advertisements claim that golf scores can be improved by purchasing new golf equipment. Since this is financially impractical for many senior players, one-half stroke per hole may be subtracted for using old equipment.

Becky said...

TTP, your golf rules were so funny I took my computer in to show my husband. He then miraculously, to me at least, e-mailed them to a friend so he could laugh, too. Thank you!

TTP said...

Thanks, Lemonade. Nothing wrong with your link but reading that sentence before seeing the translation of the original made me laugh.

Back to the gold league stuff. Gotta get the agreement over to the course today.

Misty said...

Well, I almost, almost, got this fun Monday puzzle perfectly, but didn't know the nominee Rae and took a chance on ILSA, which seemed like a reasonable name. Nope, ISSA. But MAGI and NOLI helped me get VENI early on, so I knew the others would be VIDI and VICI and filled them in. Yep, it helps if you had Latin in high school. And then came the fun of getting JULIUS CAESAR. Delightful puzzle, John--many thanks.

Loved your travel story, Boomer, and neat picture, C.C. So glad you guys had a great, if very long, trip.

Have a great week coming up, everybody.

AnonymousPVX said...

This Monday go was a nice start to the week.

Write-overs....just one, HOTITEM/HOTSHOT.

Have a good one, see you tomorrow.

Efrian from Espanola said...

Now I am against all this PC stuff and I have a healthy sense of humor but I found the comment about 40d OTOE a tad cringeworthy and somewhat disturbing.

The OTOE, I'm sure were just fine and dandy in the northern climes of the Great Lakes until "they decided" to move south to Oklahoma. Maybe I'm a bit more sympathetic to the plight of my Native neighbors since I witnessed my Tewa friends ironically chop off the foot of the statue of Conquistador Onate just outside of the Ohkay Owingeh Pueblo. (Look it up if you so desire )

OwenKL said...

I left my garden tools at the corner by mistake.
I had some good intention my land to lawn-SCAPE.
Now for lawn AMOR,
I have not a mower,
And one of my HOES was accosted by a rake!

Do not tease a SCOT about how he is built!
Do not get him MIFFED when he dresses to the hilt!
He may be a FRENEMY
To force haberdashery,
Retaliating in a way to have you kilt!

{B, B-.}

Ol' Man Keith said...

A very enjoyable Monday morning pzl. Sorry to see so many Cornerites didn't know of NOE Valley.
As a native San Franciscan I had an advantage. I used to date a girl who lived in the foothills of Twin Peaks, just above NOE Valley.

That CAESAR guy; he was nothing if not succinct. I wonder how long it took him to think up such terse, pithy comments?

Neat write-up from Boomer! Thanks for sharing your trip.
Two diagonals, one per side.
The near side anagram speaks of an embrace between competitors. I mean a...

Jayce said...

I liked this puzzle, and filled it so fast I missed out on seeing quite a few of the down clues and answers.

Intimidating the Senate to turn a centuries old republic into a dictatorship sounds vaguely familiar.

Wishing you all a good day.

Abejo said...

Good afternoon, folks. Thank you, John R. O'Brien, for a fine puzzle. Thank you, Boomer, for a fine review.

Puzzle went through pretty quickly. My last fill was GMA. Had no idea what that was. Now I know, Good Morning America.

After I got JULIUS CAESAR, I quickly saw the circles and that old Latin phrase. That was all pretty easy.

FRENEMY took me couple second looks. The perps were solid.

TROU was a stretch.

NOE Valley was new to me. I used to work in San Francisco. Of course I did not live there.

Nice Monday fast workout.

Raining here right now. Three days ago it was 6 below zero.

See you tomorrow.


( )

D4E4H said...

Carol and I FIR in 28:15 min.

Good afternoon Cornerites.

Thank you John R. O'Brien for your pleasant Monday CW.

Thank you Boomer for your excellent review.


CanadianEh! said...

Marvelous Monday. Thanks for the fun, John and Boomer (great photo).
I worked this CW online because we have no newspaper today - it is Family Day!
We celebrated all weekend and I am recovering today.

But I FIRed. Perps filled the unknown NOE and ISSA, and I know my Latin. . . and how to spell CAESAR (How often do we see Ceasar salad on the menu!!).
FRENEMY took a minute to register in my brain.
No OT in the NBA All Star game last night, but it was a great 4th quarter IMO.

YR, LOL re "commando style"
Ray - you AMUSED me today.
HG-Happy Anniversary to you and Joann.
Efrian @1:42 - yes, we in Canada are learning to be more sympathetic with our indigenous neighbours. We have pipeline issues causing rail blockades.

Wishing you all a great day.

Wilbur Charles said...

"All I needed was Bing Crosby and Raquel Welch.". Not necessarily in that order
"if someone sets up a camera in center field" …*
This why that "Noli" saying was familiar. In case there's any other Philistines in the crowd

Weekday puzzles are fun when the theme unravels


** good example of the layman's and even media's misunderstanding of the "Cheating" scandal. MLB has the camera in CF. It was the real-time usage, electronically, that comprised the cheating. It's even considered more "egregious" to have had buzzers attached than the "banging'. ie, All MLB ever had to do was monitor the usage of their feed.

OwenKL said...

Efrian, a neighbor! How welcome to see another New Mexican, and from a nearby town at that, midway between Santa Fe and Taos!

I looked up that statue podectomy, since I couldn't recall it. Not surprising since it happened 22 years ago. Sad to see the foot was replaced. There's a plaque in the Santa Fe Plaza referencing "savage natives" that was vandalized by having the word "savage" chiseled out. It was left that way, and now the defacement is itself an historical landmark. The missing foot would have been a fitting commentary to the man who ordered defeated rebels de-feeted. That story I was familiar with.

Yellowrocks said...

Canadian Eh! @3:39, glad you picked up on my quiet humor. I am now off to our President's Day dance fully clothed in red, white and blue square dance regalia.

Boomer said...

Hello again TTP. CC finally gave up the computer to me and I was able to read the comments. Your golf league rules seem fine to me. I do not play in a league but in a foursome of my bowling pals of which I am the youngest (72) however I am the only one taking aboritarone medication for cancer
which generally steals about 50 yards off my drive and approach shots. I usually move the ball around big trees, but I carry a chainsaw in my bag to cut down the smaller ones. Once in a while, a golf course makes a mistake and puts a lake between the tee and the fairway. We play the senior tees which are in front of the lake whether or not the course planned it. Good news ! I bowled today and started with 254 ! that must have worn me out because the last two games were 161 and 175. Still a 590 is a good score for me.

Jinx in Norfolk said...

OMK, did the young lady pronounce it correctly, or was she just a girl who can't say NOE?

Anonymous T said...

Hi All!

Thanks John for the Monday puzzle w/ a gnarly SW corner... OSIS & EDDA xing ISSA was a WAG-fest and I got as lucky as Boomer at The Orleans. Nice video too!

Excellent Expo Boomer.

WOs: IRIS b/f LENS (hi Jinx!), ISReaL b/f perps prevailed.
Fav: Holy TOLEDO Batman!

Misparse of the day: HOTS HOT(?). Oh, thanks, Boomer //cue V8.

{B, A-}
Enjoyed the DR & story; Jinx's 'can she say NOE' was funny.
Ray-O: Co-Pa? Really dude? :-)
Unknown: LOL HOT SH*T

YR - TMI (and LOL!)

TTP - Even with all the new rules proposed, I'll MASTER a Gentleman's Eight on each hole.

LEMON - if you're a fan of the flavor, I found these from Italy that are amazing.
//you can buy individual packets too, the pack of 12 is in my 're-order' section.

Cheers, -T

Ol' Man Keith said...

Jinx ~
Well, yes, she did know how to say NOE.
But fortunately her vocabulary was much broader than that, and we were together for a sweet couple of years...